Midrive vs Hub Motor Cont. from 2014

From 2020 EBR Forum - Mid drives vs Hub drives ??? 

"Compare that to the mid drive I'm looking at which is a Yamaha branded bike. The torque sensing works great from a stop. You don't need a throttle. When you start to put weight on the pedals like on a climb the motor senses that and gives you more. When I'm riding with my kids that have very fluctuating speeds the mid drive feels much more natural and isn't noticeable. With the cadence sensing hubs trying to manage speeds on hills or inclines was a pain. Not at all an issue with the mid drive. It just is a much more intelligent and integrated part of the bike."

And the response...

"Your comparison is not a good one because you are not comparing a high quality hubdrive with a torque and cadence sensor with a high quality mid drive bike. I have a Juiced CCX hubdrive and a Biktrix Ultra FS mid drive.

I have 3000 miles on my Juiced and 1000 miles on my Biktrix. Both are a year and a half old and I like to ride fast on smooth surfaces. As you can tell from the miles I far prefer the hub drive, and the CCX has the motor and torque sensor incredibly dialed in It is smooth and natural.

Because of the zero stress the hub motor puts on the drive train I also have much less wear on the moving parts on my Hub drive than I do on theid drive. Until you have a high quality hub drive with a torque sensor you cannot do a valid comparison....A good hubdrive ebike is very hard to beat and often gets many more miles out of a similar sized battery. My CCX battery gives me twice the miles as my Bixtrix battery and they are both 21 amps!!!"

My thoughts (tv)...

"This battle has been going since 2012 (or before) when the subject was broached by a well read article from  electric bike dot com(currently can't find it). Ideally it will continue as the comparison is educational and people working with the information are developing the data needed for the next generation of electric vehicle technology."

The final word (From 2020 EBR Forum)

"The CCX is a 'cheap' torque based hub drive (which is why I bought it), feels nothing like a high quality torque based hub drive like a stromer....

I also own 2 Brose mid-drives (eMTB(6k miles) and speed pedelec/commuter(3k miles)). The pedaling feel is in a whole different level and why I own them.

No way my CCX goes twice as far for the same watthour as my eMTB(630wh) or commuter(500wh). My testing which I have logged shows the mid-drive to be best at low speeds/hills, at middle speeds (18-24mph) they are about the same. At higher speeds (24mph+) the hub drive seems to have the edge but by no means a factor of 2...

I have and ride both types and both have their strengths and weaknesses.

Im currently speccing the parts for what I hope to be a 'high quality torque based hub drive'. I will be using a GMAC 10T hub motor, phaserunner, cycle analyst 3 and torque/cadence sensor from grin technologies.

I actually prefer mid-drives for various reasons but for this use case, a hub drive will be better"